Patrick Hobbins, b. abt 1780 Curraghmore, Kilbarron, Tipperary, Ireland

We've discovered that Denis's Parents are Patrick Hobbins and Owney.  Owney is a pet name for Honorah we are told.

We find Patrick Hobbins and an Owney having a child the same time as Denis and Catherine in 1841.  the record was from the Terryglass Catholic Church.

We find a Patrick in Curraghmore, Kilbarron, Tipperary Ireland.  We believe this is the same fellow.

Tithe Applitments showing Patrick Hobbins.

Map of Tipperary area, showing areas where Hobbins are located.

note: thanks to Lulu B. who sent the map informtion..

map of Tipperary,  locations of Hobbins.
chances are they are related.

1. Carrig, Monsea
2. Annabeg, Monsea
3. Glenbower,
4. Annagh
5 Rathmore, Borrisokane
6. Lorrha

These are the distances from Borrisokane:

Terryglass 10 Km.
Nenagh 18 km.
Roscrea 29 km.
Borrisoleigh 43 km.
Thurles 50 km.

Patrick Hobbins and Honora Gleeson, family record

From the records that we can find,  this could possibly be Patrick and Honarah's family.  Mostly chosen because of the proximity to each other.

Nineteenth-century Irish family naming patterns usually followed the guidelines in the list below pretty closely:

Denis 1813 was married twice, first to Catherine,  then to Ellen. His children are with Catherine; Patrick Joseph, Denis, Martin, Michael.  With Ellen; Catherine, Anne, Ellen, Holly,  and finally Denis.

1.  The oldest son was named after the father’s father.    (Therefore Denis's father's name would be Patrick.)

2.  The oldest daughter was named after the mother’s mother.  (Margaret - we know that Ellen Loughnane's mother's name is Margaret)

3.  The second son was named after the mother’s father.  The second son was named Denis but passed in 1841 in Tipperary.   Denis's third son is named Martin 

4.  The third son was named after the father. (therefore Denis's first wife's father would be Martin)  and there was a Martin Quinlisk in close proximity to Glenbower. Quinlisk was an unusual name in the area.

5.  The fourth son was named after the father’s oldest brother.

(who passed was named Michael in 1849 in Ashburnham, Ontario.

6.  The second daughter was named after the father’s mother. (Catherine was the first wife)  Ellen already had an older daughter Margaret from a previous marriage.

7.  The third daughter was named after the mother. (Ellen)

8.  The fourth daughter was named after the mother’s oldest sister. (might be Holly or Anne)  I find Holly on the 1871 Census but no reference to her before or after that.)

note: in the 1871 there is a John listed.  I find no reference to him before or after. I'm not sure how he fits in. I think the John and Margaret who were born before Denis's first wife died, were from a previous marriage of Ellen's.  The last we see of either one of them is in the 1871 census.  they are the only two who cannot read and write.

update:  I believe that John, Margaret and Patrick the second are children of Ellen's first marriage to Michael Heenan who died in ___. 

I found that Denis was indeed married before to a Catherine Quinlisk, and two other sons (2) Denis and a fourth son Michael.  Looking at the Irish naming traditions with this new information, it looks like this.

1. Oldest son = father's father.  Patrick (true)

2. Second son - Denis  (?)

3. Third son = Mother's father.  Martin.  (y)  haven't found Martin's birth record, but if he's the third son, this fits.

4. Fourth son - perhaps a brother -  Michael  

5. fifth son -   Denis (y)

So far this is what we know.

IJH

   

There is a Denis in Carrig, Monsea, Tipperary who emigrated to London, Middlesex, Ontario,  The same names flow thru their boys,  I think they must be related.  cousins perhaps.